EP042 – Meet The People w/Ben & Keith at Sundance

02.26.2026 - Season: 1 Episode 42

Park City, 2026 — we showed up without films, without press credentials, but still… ready to make our DocWalk dreams a reality. Welcome to the last of 4 episodes at Sundance: a walk down Main Street, where we hobnob with the best of the fest, greet the people, and do everything we can to stay warm in sub-freezing temps without a single movie ticket in sight.

This year at Sundance everyone was looking back (at the legacy of Robert Redford and what the fest has been) while still looking forward (to where we’ll be in a year… Boulder, Colorado). We catch-up on the festival BizBuzz™: it’s all M&A! Mergers and acquisitions (netflix/paramount/warners, oh my) and whether the indie spirit is actually back (Ben says it is). As men of the people, we focus on the men (& women) on the street. And they have a lot to say. Entertainment lawyer Ben Moskowitz breaks down what not to do when you’re pitching, first-time producer Will Butler shares the innovations of JOYBUBBLES—the first film at Sundance to screen with open audio description for blind audiences, and Tribeca programmer Jarod Neece offers insight into the numbers game that you’ve gotta overcome when applying to a premier fest. We meet David Fortune, who turned a million-dollar grant into his debut feature COLOR BOOK, Jamaican producer/lawyer Rob Maylor who’s about to make Delroy Lindo a first-time director, and filmmaker Dana Reilly fresh off her OUR BODY ELECTRIC premiere. Austin-based producers Russell Groves and Jessica Wolfson make brief cameos and former-Austinite Heather Courtney joins us to talk about the film she’s producing with Christina Ibarra, and the one she’s directing (thx to a Chicken & Egg research grant).

Plus: surprise run-ins with editor Josh Ethier, publicist David Magdael and doc-superstar Ondi Timoner; Aaaand an owl that’s been in 150 movies; a meteorologist and horses; and insight into a Park City real estate deal that proves that karma is real, but the best deals are behind us. Thanks to the Austin Film Society and The Long Time for sponsoring our trip! This one is a super-sized DocWalks with 50% more runtime, and a whole lot of fun!

DISCUSSION LINKS:

TIMESTAMPS:

00:00 Ben is cold — arrival in Park City 03:58 Main Street dispatch — the last Sundance in Park City 07:00 First-timers and the indie spirit question 08:00 Jordan Tracy — ABC4 live weather with horses 11:50 Russell Groves and Jessica Wolfson 17:50 Ben Moskowitz on how new filmmakers find a lawyer 21:00 Good ideas, bad ideas — don’t promise access you don’t have 25:15 Will Butler and JOYBUBBLES — open audio description at Sundance 29:00 Jarod Neece — Tribeca at 25 and the 14,000-film funnel 37:10 Kino Lorber re-releasing Tower — breaking news 41:00 Bill and Robin — Park City locals since the sixties 44:30 Night falls — BizBuzz™ on Main Street 48:00 Dana Reilly — OUR BODY ELECTRIC premieres at Dances With Films 52:30 TOWER superfan and the sorority screening 55:00 David Fortune — COLOR BOOK and the AT&T Untold Stories million 58:30 Dapper dressed rule of thumb 1:01:30 Rob Maylor — producing Delroy Lindo’s directorial debut 1:05:00 Josh Ethier — editing BUDDY from TOO MANY COOKS director Casper Kelly 1:09:30 Eagle and Spencer — skiing, Fugazi, and CARTS OF DARKNESS 1:14:00 Day three — Heather Courtney and Chicken & Egg research grant 1:19:00 David Magdael — publicist, Oscar campaigns, and changing the world through cinema and Ondi(!) Timoner 1:22:30 Heather’s final thoughts — call your representatives 1:29:30 Driving away from Sundance — reflections on community and the grind 1:36:00 Sponsor messages and next episode preview — Anna Rau and the Nonfiction Hot List

Okay.

Rolling.

Marker.

Boom.

Ben is cold.

That's the theme of this moment.

You're gonna hear that a lot on this podcast.

Ben is

cold.

And you know why I am cold, Keith?

Oh yeah.

It's because I

thought you're cold.

'cause it's fucking cold out.

It's well that, and we're in the mountains where it's cold.

We are in Park City, Utah.

That's why Ben is Cole.

We're back here in Park City, in Utah at Sundance.

This is Doc Walks year two.

This is our second year doing this podcast.

Keith Mayland.

It's weird because it's not 50.

We're down at 52 episodes.

Correct.

Because we started a little late.

We tried to figure our footing.

Yes.

And every once in a while we need a break.

Hey, who's counting?

You're the only one counting here.

We are.

We're doing great.

We're on our second year.

We're back at Sundance.

We are here courtesy of our friends, the Austin Film Society.

That's

the thing is this is a sponsored trip, right?

So we're gonna do four episodes, maybe more.

Hopefully more.

And we're here in Sundance.

Uh, thanks to our friends at the Austin Film

Society.

Film Society, as well as our friends at the long time.

The long time has sponsored several episodes in the past.

Yeah.

And they helped us pack our bags, get on a plane, rent a car, stay in

a very nice house in the mountains, and walk up and down these streets.

Yes.

To bring Sundance to you.

The doc walks audience

for me to be cold so that you guys don't have to be,

if you hadn't heard.

That's right.

Well, so we're here for the next, uh, three days.

We have lots of interviews lined up.

We are gonna walk around and meet people on the streets.

Then are we gonna see movies?

Uh, not intentionally.

Probably not.

We'll probably not see this unless somebody gives us tickets.

We're not gonna see any movies.

Do we have press credentials?

Uh, no.

Although we tried.

We haven't been taken seriously

yet.

But

there's something charming about that.

I don't know.

It's, you know, we're the underdogs here.

You know, we're the fish outta water.

That's true.

But we do have two very beautiful sponsors, so we're not.

Pure Indie.

That's true.

We've made it

to the middle.

Thanks to our friends at the awesome Film Society and the long

time for, uh, the shot in the arm.

That's right.

You know.

Uh, alright, well here we are on Main Street.

We're gonna go meet the people.

I need a cup of coffee.

Oh, me too.

You're gonna warm up a little bit.

We might duck into the Adobe House.

We might find ourselves at the Impact Lounge.

Oh, I thought you were gonna say find ourselves a new sponsor.

Shout out Adobe.

Maybe they're next.

Well, you know what?

I've given Adobe, they could subscribe to me since I subscribed to them.

Amen.

Just call,

call it a deal.

The world has changed and the world has changing Right before our eyes.

This is the last sentence.

If you haven't been paying attention, this is the last sentence

that's gonna take place here

in Park City.

Yep.

Here in Park City before it moves to Boulder next year.

And hopefully we'll be there to, uh,

well, let's walk

and dock in that one.

Let's not get, you know, counter chickens before they hatch.

Okay.

What we will do though is enjoy the Sundance.

Be in the moment.

Let's be where we are.

Okay.

Amen.

So,

and with that,

we're gonna be at Park City at Sundance.

And with that, a shout out to, uh, Robert Redford.

We got this whole ball rolling and who passed recently?

So it's celebrating, uh, truly scrappy independent voices and we're very

excited to hear more about that.

And once again, Sundance has kind of up with Academy Award nominations,

so there's a lot of buzz in the audience about who jumped from the

shortlist to the even shorter list.

That's right.

And

film a premier here last year that are now being nominated.

So, uh, that's

right.

And so there's some folks in this crowd walking just a little bit higher Yeah.

Than the rest of us.

We're gonna talk to some of them.

Uh, we're gonna track down, uh, some, some swag.

Oh, are we?

Okay,

we're gonna,

let's go get a

couple shots.

We're gonna cut.

We're gonna cut is what we're gonna do.

Uh, roll the music Dayton.

And we will catch you guys on the other side to Walken

Dock here at Park City, Utah.

For some news.

Ding, ding, ding.

On your left,

you're listening to Dock Walks

with Ben and Keith.

What you are seeing is a bridge, some ski lifts and a bus that says

Prospector to Park City Mountain.

Because we

are in Park City and that is why we are so bundled up looking dapper.

We are prospecting, we're looking for gold in these hills,

and I think we found it here at the Sundance Film Festival the

last year that is in Park City.

Ben's second Park City, Sundance Doc Walk, second Park City, Sundance.

That's

right.

And Park City's final

and

Sundance of all time.

It's kind of amazing to be back, Keith, because last year

we launched the podcast here.

This is like the first.

Thing we that we really did, where we officially announced we were doing it.

It's really cool that we're, we're here again.

Round two.

We're about 40 episodes.

Yep.

Past where we started.

And we're walking down the street.

We're about to take a left on seventh and find ourselves on main.

When you think of Sundance, what do you think about Ben?

Uh,

historically,

well, historically, I think about Robert Redford starting this and

how this was like where indie films came to be enjoyed by film lovers

who came from all over the world.

And I think that is still true.

Um, but what I think about now is that this is like the

epicenter of our industry.

Everybody who, uh, has anything to do with funding films, distributing

films, potentially selling their films are here for this weekend.

And they are all going to parties and networking, excited to see movies.

Yeah.

What do you think of

When I think of, when I think of Sundance, I think of Sex Lies and Videotape.

I think of Slacker, I think of Clerks.

I think of Petty Lane's nuts.

Oh,

that's great.

I think of Ko Treasure Hunter, the Zelner Brothers film.

Yep.

When I think of Sundance, I think of like the pinnacle goal of every young filmmaker

who was young back when we were young.

I question whether it is still that pinnacle.

I question whether,

oh, I think it is,

it has been gate kept so much.

Is there still diamonds in the rough being discovered here at Sundance

and being, uh, being presented to the world for first time?

Are there new voices being championed or is this an establishment,

an industry institution?

Um,

is it both?

I think yes, it's both.

Uh, because it is definitely for established filmmakers.

We're gonna see some famous people here, some big premieres, but we

also know that there are a lot of first time filmmakers here.

Uh, we're gonna talk to one of them actually.

Yeah.

Oh yeah.

Let's talk to some of them.

Um, let's talk to this guy over here.

Howdy, howdy,

howdy.

How's it going?

Where are you and what you be doing out here?

Uh, we are our A, b, C four and we're just covering the beginning

day of Sundance Film Festival.

Nice.

So this is my first and last Sundance.

Oh, wow.

Firsthand.

I'm from Pennsylvania, so

Amazing.

Yeah.

This is my first sun

dancing.

I've leaving, well, it was my first last year.

Okay.

And I will tell you, I kind of had some nerves.

Yeah.

So how are you feeling?

I feel great.

I mean, I want to come and do like a. Staycation down here at Park City.

It is really beautiful.

Isn't, it's like, why would you ever leave this place?

Who needs Boulder, Colorado?

Yeah, that's true.

And so are you the on-camera talents here for the

I I am the weekend anchor.

The weekend anchor editor.

What's your name?

Jordan.

Tracy.

Hey Jordan.

Are you about to do a standup here?

We're about to go live here at the top of the six o'clock news.

Oh my God.

Talking about Robert Redford's legacy and the, uh, gala that's

gonna honor him tomorrow.

Yes.

Awesome.

That's very cool.

Would you give us a, a taste?

Would you give us like a little, you probably, you probably

don't need the practice.

Sure.

Would you give us a little quick run through?

Absolutely.

So it's actually a perfect fit.

That Sundance's largest fundraiser of the year is also honoring the legacy

of Robert Redford is his passion was to connect filmmakers and support

filmmakers and all the money raised.

We'll go to the workshops that they do year round.

So it's kind of a perfect way to honor him at the largest fundraiser.

You're gonna kill it.

That was great.

Awesome.

Awesome man.

Alright.

Appreciate y'all.

Thanks.

Nice time.

Have a good one.

Enjoy it.

Main Street.

The action is just beginning the street.

Its relatively empty compared to where it will be this time tomorrow.

Oh yeah.

This is Especi Saturday.

This is quiet.

Alright, what are our goals here at Sundance?

This time, Ben Steinhower,

my goal is to talk to the largest cross section of dock filmmakers that we can.

And we have a lot of very cool interviews lined up and I can't

wait to, uh, see who all we meet.

Uh, because last year, just walking up and down the street,

we met so many amazing people.

Uh, one of my favorite duos was the team behind, uh, breaking Through Rocks,

who, by the way, as of today, Oscar nominees

the first Iranian film to ever be nominated for an Oscar, and we

bumped into them at the Adobe Lounge,

which we just walked past.

So it's that kind of fortuitous meeting that I am looking for and excited about,

synchronicity.

What about you Keith?

What are you excited about?

Well, I'll be honest, I have been three times the Sundance without a film, but

each time I have left with Fortune in my pocket, each time I have either added

an executive producer to a project, I have seen a significant funding

opportunity, um, explode into reality.

Or what happened last year, I met an exec in line at a party.

It took from January all the way till November before I actually

got on a Zoom call with her.

But in the process of talking to her, we negotiated and are in the

process of negotiating a development deal for one of my projects.

Amazing.

And so, even though I'm here with you to meet the people to

talk and walk and dock, secretly,

you're

working.

We're not that secretly, I'm hoping to meet somebody with some money in their

pockets and some excitement about working together and finding some support for

indie doc filmmaking, which is despite.

The looks of being here on this podcast.

Podcasting isn't paying the bills.

Oh, it's not

that yet.

But indie doc filmmaking has for these last couple years and I'm

hoping it can continue to into 2026.

Love it.

And look, here's another standup here with some horses.

Let's check this.

What's your name and what are you doing?

I'm Chief Meteorologist, just Alana Brophy from a BC News in Salt Lake City.

We always come up for Sundance.

This is a big one for us.

We're ending Sundance in Salt Lake Bidding.

Farewell, but we know this is Sundance's Home.

Come on.

Since 1978, you're not gonna get rid of the love of the mountain town.

That's right.

Forecasting live on Main Street tonight, which we absolutely love.

I love it.

And you're doing great.

You are on.

You're getting me excited.

What are the horses doing here with your Forecasts?

County Sheriff's deputies, that's cash and that's Tater.

All right.

And these

guys were nice enough to stand by for our first weather.

We're one minute to the top.

Top.

It looks, it looks cool in the background.

Absolutely.

Those guys are awesome.

Where are you guys from?

We're from Austin, Texas.

Oh,

welcome.

Keith Austin.

Weird, right?

Hey, look at you.

Yeah, totally.

Yeah.

You must have been.

Yes.

Great.

Swat.

I lived in Boise and everyone said Boise was a smaller.

Austin.

So went visited in Austin.

Very cool.

awesome.

Very cool.

Yeah.

Well thank you for the time.

We'll get outta the way here so you guys can do your thing you guys.

30 seconds folks.

Alright.

You, so you heard it here first.

Well they

heard it live first and then you heard it

about a week later.

It's gonna be cold.

Is this is the forecast?

Yeah, it's uh, not gonna snow, which uh, is good.

Good for me and my thin cold blood come, but it's still gonna be very cold.

I think you said the high on Sunday is 24 or something Crazy.

Okay, we're on the lookout for somebody who looks like

they've got something to say.

There's Russell Groves.

How you doing?

My friend on Main Street.

And who do we see?

Well, I the one and only,

you know, it was a year ago that we was, Hey.

Hey.

How's it going?

Howdy.

It's good.

I'm Ben.

Ben.

Keith.

David.

Good to see you dude.

Good to

meet you.

Oh,

Keith.

S to see you

man.

Bens collide.

Bens.

I like it.

Couple

Ben.

The two Bens collide.

Just a couple.

Welcome to Sundance 2026.

Thank you, man.

The last one where you're standing.

The last one in Park City.

I know that's right.

So what are you, what are you doing right now?

We were just meeting with some friends.

Cool.

Favorite spot or one of the favorite spots?

No name Saloon.

Nice.

Obviously the convergence is happening and you get all the people

saying you know what's going on.

What are you hearing?

Right.

You know, what

are you working,

what is going on?

What is, yeah,

yeah.

What are you working on?

Right.

Who are you working on?

That's usually the question.

Yeah.

But that's awesome.

It's good.

It's good to see everybody.

Yeah, man.

Cool.

I don't know, it's, it's, it's one of those, I think it's gonna

be a very, very good Sundance, probably in memoriam, obviously for.

For Redford and, and for the festival.

It's kind of like both.

Is it

emotional for you at all?

Like I know you've been going with these a long time.

I think maybe a little bit.

I, I feel like the, the first year that I came here was 2010.

Yeah.

And I've come about 10 years and there is like this, this like kinship that

I have with this festival that I feel like it, it helps me kick off the year.

I think I said that even last year.

Yeah.

So I think it going to Boulder is gonna be a little, uh, bittersweet, but it,

you know, it'll become its own iteration.

New chapter.

So I don't, I'm not gonna cry for it, but it's also will

make the most of it this year.

Exactly.

Yeah.

There you go.

Figure out, you said it yourself.

This Sundance is, is, is about remembering Robert Redford and all that he did to

kind of create Sundance and, and to create so many streams of opportunity

for independent filmmakers for Oh, yeah.

Decades.

Absolutely.

It's a way to celebrate this town which opened, has opened its doors.

For all these years, and also kind of a recognition, you know, we were

all three of us this time last year talking here at Sundance about the fires

in LA that were driving people from their homes and driving the industry.

I know.

What's the big story outside of Redford and, and the moving of the festival?

What's the, what do you think the big story of this year is gonna be?

Well, I think that with the m and a stuff that's happening, I think that there's a

lot of questions about who is new in the business that's gonna kind of mix this up.

Yeah.

You

mean mergers and acquisitions?

Mergers and acquisitions.

Yeah.

The Warn

Brothers sale and Netflix.

Yeah, exactly.

All that stuff.

I think that that's kind of thrown this into a different territory of like

question marks, but I'm hearing a lot of new distributors are coming into the

space and there's a lot of new money.

Cool.

I think there's a lot of stuff even with different rebates across the,

the, the United States, obviously.

Texas.

Yeah.

where

live.

Yeah.

So I think that.

I look at it as opportunistic in a, in the best of ways and see who's open

for business, see who is buying stuff.

Uh, and I'm being told I have to head down.

Alright, you gotta go

see

you man.

Well, uh, but yeah, I mean I think that that's, that's what it's, I feel like that

make the most of it, meet with people, get the lay of the land and I dunno.

Ask me on Monday.

Yeah.

Actually, I actually think by Monday I'll know

we should, we should do a postmortem.

We'll do, yeah, I'm, because we, yeah, because I'm gonna meet with a bunch

of people throughout the weekend and I think that that'll truly be the

litmus test of Yeah, it was my theory.

Correct.

Love

it.

And I don't know if it will be, we'll see.

All right.

Cool.

Russell pass the mic to Jessica Wilson.

Jessica Wilson.

Hey.

Hey Jessica.

can't talk

a party.

Thanks.

Great

to see us.

I'll see.

Hey.

Hi Jessica Wilson.

We recording?

We just got here.

We're walking up and down Main Street.

Do you guys wanna come to the ya later?

You a bar?

Nine 30 ish.

Oh, uh, Keith is gonna go, I am gonna go home.

A bunch of docs, people are gonna be there.

Excellent.

Awesome.

Bro, you lead

you guys.

You guys should tell me all about this is

not on the

record.

Where you

off to now?

A party at, uh, St. Rachel's

Ooh, lot.

That does sound fancy.

Yeah.

Alright.

Good to see you guys.

It's so great to see you.

This is awesome.

I'm sure we'll be bumming into you a lot and can't wait, uh, to party more.

Give us, uh, just a, a quick, like how are you feeling being here right now?

Uh, I'm very happy to be at the last Sundance in Park City because I feel sad

that it is so fun to run into people.

Yeah.

And fun to see and excited to see movies and it's cold, which is kind of nice.

It's so cold.

Yes.

Although we're about to have cold.

Well, except for we're about to have a record snowstorm

in Austin while we're gone.

I heard that.

Yeah.

sucks for them.

Very hard.

Sorry,

suckers.

Sorry.

Families deal with that.

Um,

drip The pipes we're in Park City.

Oh my God.

You need to actually interview me when I'm,

you know.

No, you're on fire.

No, this is great.

Well, good to see you.

Go to your parties.

We'll, we'll see you again soon.

Ary.

Super producer Jessica Wolfson.

Um, well Keith, we're coming up on the Sundance Marquee.

Alright, let's

can get a shot of that.

I'm getting fairly cold at this point.

I would love to have a cheeseburger.

I'm warmed by the memory of Robert Redford.

Yeah.

Well now that makes it sound like I'm not warmed by the memory of Robert Redford.

So should we cut in between here?

Do it?

No.

'cause I don't wanna have to high five again.

Okay.

Fair.

I'm gonna flip around and get some walking shots here.

Alright.

We are here with Ben Mosque.

Hey buddy.

Hey,

how's it going?

Good, good.

Great to be here with you.

So Ben, you're an entertainment lawyer?

I am,

yes.

And, uh, what kind of clients are you repping out here at Sunrise?

Most are directors, production companies, a couple of writers, anybody who's doing

anything creative who's not a big studio.

That's who I like to work with.

Oh, so you're like, I couldn't make more money, but I'm deciding

I'm a man.

You're taking a vow of poverty to

work

with.

started a pa uh, on unscripted shows, realized that physical production

wasn't for me and, but I still wanted to be part of the creative process.

Then you went to law

school?

Then?

I went to law school.

Nice.

Yeah.

That's awesome.

Yeah.

And you and Katie Colbin?

Yes.

Who is my agent?

Us, which is how we know each other.

You guys started in the mail room, is that right?

were NBC pages to,

that's right.

Yeah,

which was a great experience.

I applied to the page program.

I didn't get in.

You still

Yeah, there's still, you put it in a good word.

There's still, there's still

hope for you.

The oldest page.

Ooh, that actually sounds like that could be premier in here.

That's

a great Right.

Exactly.

I'll I apply to the page program and I'll shoot, I'll film the whole thing.

It's a

weird unscripted offshoot of, uh, 30 Rock.

Oh yeah, yeah,

yeah.

And then we will reconvene at, uh, Boulder in 2028 with your, at

the premiere of the oldest page.

Let's be ambitious.

Go for 2027.

Nick, let's, I think this is a short, I don't think this is a feature.

I think it's a short,

this dreaming

on peacock.

Yeah.

All right.

So what are you most excited about?

Let's walk on talk.

Yeah.

Okay.

Um, where are we gonna walk to?

She's good.

She's down there.

Let's see.

Most excited for this year.

I think the festival has kind of gone back to its indie roots a little bit.

Okay.

There's a lot of projects looking for distribution and.

I'm excited to see what the buyers are gonna do.

You know, there's a lot of m and a talk recently.

Our friends over at Netflix and HBO especially are, I think, gonna show that

they are still willing to make deals and engage in competitive practices.

So that's a, that's a hope that I'm looking for.

And then just seeing what kind of new faces are coming

outta the doc space right now.

Yeah.

Um,

we talked to a director yesterday who it, she's, it's her first

premier or, or sorry, first feature.

Mm-hmm.

She has no distributor.

Uh, she did like a Kickstarter for a movie.

Yep.

So it does feel like there, there are some indie films here.

Yeah.

I mean, even on the scripted side, there's a bunch of indie films that are seemingly

really good, getting a lot of great buzz.

And, you know, the hope is that we can get back to a theatrical model where it makes

sense for indies to stay in production.

I wanna know, how does a new voice, a new filmmaker connect.

With an entertainment lawyer when they haven't done a lot to show for themselves.

They haven't kind of passed through the gates.

Yeah.

But they're on their way.

Like how do you, how do you, how do they find you?

So it's actually a lot easier to find a lawyer than it is an

agent or manager oftentimes.

Yeah.

You know, our work is agnostic to what the person has done before,

what the person is gonna do next.

We are really looking for people that we can build practices around who are

great people to work with, who are doing things that we, as, you know, individuals

and people can connect with and enjoy.

You know, I think that's one of the biggest parts of my practices.

I like the work that my clients are doing, and I wanna be able to champion for them.

So if it's a new voice who has a great idea, that's a wonderful thing.

It's sometimes even better than an existing production company or director

who is just moving on to the next thing, because that's what they have to do.

Right.

So, so you'd recommend, like, 'cause we're, we think of this as like, you know.

If we were 20 years old and starting out, we would hope

something like this would exist.

Yeah.

So for somebody who has never worked with an entertainment lawyer,

maybe doesn't have an agent or manager, you're saying they could

just literally reach out to you?

I get cold outreach all the time.

Cool.

Uh, sometimes they are more fruitful than others.

Sure.

But you have to be willing to put yourself out there.

Be human.

Mm-hmm.

Think about making a genuine connection.

And it's not always the right time or place for someone to hire a

lawyer, but at least have an initial conversation, get some thoughts.

If the lawyer is someone who is looking to build a career around

people in the entertainment space, more often than not you will get

someone to spend time with you.

Cools.

Alright.

Ben, what have you learned over your years at this festival?

I have learned that the project is ultimately going to.

W either resonate with audiences or not.

Generally speaking, when you see something at Sundance and the crowd

reaction is really strong, the reaction will be decently strong

when it gets wider distribution.

Okay.

So it's a real litmus test.

It's a, it is a good litmus test.

I also think that this is, I think, one of the best festivals still for

relationship building where there's so much opportunity to meet and talk with

people from across various sectors of the industry that you can find people who

are doing similar things, find people who are doing completely opposite things and

try to glean a little bit of information.

It's celebratory, like people here want films and projects to succeed.

Hmm.

Yeah.

That's cool.

I love it.

Well, and so what are you thinking about it being the last year?

Are you, uh, are you, are you having some like, uh.

Emotional memories about Yeah.

Times past, you know, or are you excited that it's going to Boulder

and it's gonna be a whole new thing?

I'm excited that it'll be a new thing.

I think that Park City has been a wonderful home to the festival

for a long time, and I'll miss it.

I'll miss coming here.

Well, in the spirit of our audience, of new listeners, they're your gloves.

Um, what,

having worked with a lot of different creatives, a lot of different

directors and writers, what advice do you have for young filmmakers

outside of the legal sphere?

Ooh,

I like this and, well, no, you answered this one and I got

a good, I got a good thought.

So it's gonna, it's gonna sound like a line that a lot of networks executives

use, but if you find a good project, if you have a good idea, something

that you can latch onto that people will, it'll resonate with people.

You'll find an audience for good ideas.

Never go outta style.

Yeah.

I think that's, that's the best thing.

I like that.

But I want to talk about bad ideas.

Sure.

As a lawyer.

Yeah.

You've seen some shit.

Yeah.

We see

bad ideas

all time.

What are some common, what's like maybe the, like if you had to give

one nugget of advice for like what to avoid to a young filmmaker To

keep them out of stepping in it.

Yeah.

What would it be?

It would be, don't guarantee or say that you can get rights to some

IP or person or property until you actually have that in the back.

Uh oh.

Ah, one thing

I was doing that last night, I said,

oops.

Yeah.

If you say you've got Celebrity X who wants to do a biopic about

them and they've never met you?

Ooh,

bad idea.

Bad idea.

Ben's gotta stop pitching that Kanye piece.

He's been

damn Kanye.

If you're listening,

yeah.

Don't reach out to me.

It's Genius, part two.

Yeah.

Hey, joy Bubbles.

All right.

Yeah.

Great movie.

You know

it,

uh, we talked to the director yesterday.

Oh, Rachel?

Yes, it's Rachel.

Yeah, that's right.

Amazing.

Yeah, I'm

a producer on it.

Oh, no way.

Awesome.

I'm Ben Will, nice to meet you.

Hey Will Keith.

Hey Will.

Yeah, we saw your hat.

We got the same hats.

We're uh, hell yeah.

We're psyched.

Yeah.

And

you guys talking to her about, uh, where were you talking to her about

it?

We do a podcast called Doc Walks.

Oh, you did Doc Walk?

Yeah.

Handing you

a micro, we're handing you a microphone.

Oh, sick.

Yes.

She loved her doc walk.

Yeah.

Oh, amazing.

Okay.

Yeah.

She

talking to the mic for us.

Yeah.

Hey, hey.

Hey.

What's up Doc Walk?

Hey, this is Will Butler from Joy Bubbles.

There you are.

Alright.

Check it out.

Everybody

will.

What do you, what do you hope happens for Joy Bubbles this week?

I hope Joy Bubbles gets his, gets his due.

You know, what he always deserved, which is to be recognized as one of

the, the greatest, you know, progenitors of, of, of joy and, and togetherness.

That we also dearly need in these, in these trying times.

Amen.

Are you a phone freak yourself?

Uh, I'm a modern day phone freak.

Maybe.

You know, the blind community has always been on the cutting edge

of, of new technology, right?

Yeah.

So as a blind person, we're always in the lookout for the next greatest

piece of assistive technology.

It doesn't always come in the form of a medical device or

something that, something that's designed for blind people.

Sometimes it's as simple as a telephone.

So we're just thrilled to be here and, and really excited about the

response so far and, and, uh, yeah, looking forward to seeing, you

know, a new life for Joy Bubbles.

Yeah.

Uh, you know, and in death, you know, a new life.

We were just talking because Ben is an entertainment lawyer.

He and I worked together.

He reps a lot of other films and he was making the point

that there's a lot of indie.

Films here this year that it feels more like in that kind of scrappy, you know,

first Spirit and we were using your movie as an example, like Oh, amazing.

Rachel being a, a first time feature director and premier here.

First time feature director.

I'm first time doc producer.

Awesome.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

We're, we're, we're, we're thrilled.

And, and the blind community's really turning out too, like, um, I'm sure

she told you we're the first film ever at Sundance to screen actually with

open audio description for the blind.

So there's gonna be two dedicated screenings where, um, the, the

description for blind people actually plays over the theater speakers.

And no one's ever been brave enough to do that before.

Um, least of all.

I mean, a lot of these films don't even deliver audio description.

Right.

Period.

Right with the headset.

And so for someone who's like blind like me, like we have, we can't experience the

movie fully like you would in a theater or you would on streaming at festivals.

Yeah.

So we're hoping that by playing with audio description, we're showing

other indies that they can do it too.

It's not a big lift to get an audio description track recorded.

And we hope next year there's like, you know, double the movies with

with with ad for, for blind people.

You're here.

That's amazing.

Well, thank you so much.

Wills good for jumping meet you in.

Yeah.

Good luck to Joy Bubbles.

That's right.

Thanks.

So awesome.

Great to meet you.

We, we apparently, from what we hear the p and i screening

this morning, uh, people were

crying and Wow.

It was 9:00 AM so amazing.

That's good.

So that's good.

Yeah.

Hopefully they were tears of joy.

Tears of joy.

Bubbles.

That's right.

Bubbles.

That's right.

Awesome.

All have a great

talk to

you.

Good, good spot, Ben.

That's it.

Um, all right.

We were wrapping up with good ideas, bad ideas.

Yes.

We, uh, let's, let's, let's hear.

Oh, dark Ben took us Yes.

Into the dark idea, dark idea sphere.

Well, it was don't promise you have access.

Yeah, that's right.

That's right.

If you don't have access, I, I myself have been guilty of that at times.

I mean, how it's

good to be ambitious but then you have to deliver.

You have to deliver.

That's right.

Uh, alright, well thanks so much for It's great to meet you.

Thanks for having me.

Enjoy the rest of the fest.

Thank you.

You too.

Yeah.

And uh,

and here we are at the Marriott.

I guess here

we're at the Marriott.

We're walking down Main Street.

We just finished a long form interview that you guys may have heard last

week or you might hear next week.

We don't know what order these things are gonna come in, but

we do know is when we see an old friend, we gotta stop and say hi.

Howdy.

And look who it is.

It's Jared Ne.

That's right.

Jared Neese, formerly of South by Southwest of many years now.

Of Tribeca of several years.

Yes.

Yep.

Four years now.

Uh, and here you are in Park City.

Welcome

down street.

Yeah.

Last one.

Burning it down.

That's right.

Last one in Park City.

How you feeling or do you have

Uh, I feel good.

I mean, you know, there's no snow, which is actually kind of nice.

It's easier to get around my daughter.

It's her first Sundance.

Oh, fun.

How old is your daughter?

She's 19.

She's a, uh, intern for FS pr.

Oh, fun.

Yeah, so she's working.

Um, so it's all, I mean, when I first came to Sundance we didn't, I didn't have a

daughter, so it's, uh, yeah, it's cool.

It's great.

Yeah.

That's awesome.

So, uh, what are you doing?

Are you here watching movies?

Combination.

Watching movies?

We have some, some panels, uh, that we're kind of taking part in for,

uh, some of our sponsors at Tribeca.

Running into people on the street, like you guys, you know,

getting interviewed, you know,

your primary focus, uh, programming and looking for what to invite?

Yeah, just try to find, you know, see the stuff that we don't have

screeners for, and then always like, you know, hearing what people are

interested in, what, what the buzz is.

What are you hearing buzz about?

Like what movies

are you interested?

It was only a couple days, you know, obviously, but last night I think people

really liked that horror film buddy.

Okay.

Uh, there was just like the, the, who's that guy though?

Purple guy.

Oh, Barney.

I think it's like, oh, Barney.

Yes.

Barney goes those crazy kind of thing.

Oh, whoa.

Yeah, it says dark and deep and weird, which is I'm all for me.

Um, I'm excited for the moment, the Charlie XCX thing, and I'm

excited for Mama Meley and pregnant.

Wow.

I don't know, just excited for a lot of stuff.

It's all, you know, there's a lot of cool stuff I've already seen.

I don't know with, I can say things, but, uh, there's a lot of movies.

Cool.

How about y'all?

You watching movies?

No, we are here doing this.

Okay.

We're watching for filmmakers and, uh, and other producers.

Distributors.

executives.

Or executives, executive entertainment lawyer.

And now we've got our, you're our first programmer, although we are

staying in a house with James Faust.

Aw, so we're, we're programmer adjacent.

Yes.

Programmer adjacent.

That's

right.

House is very programmer.

Yes.

Uh,

that's right.

What is gonna be new at.

Tribeca this year.

How

is Tribe Work?

Uh, it's our 25th anniversary, so that's a big deal.

Um, you know, we're gonna be having like, at a big event, like

celebrating the past 25 years, like where we come, where we're going.

Yeah.

We got a lot of cool stuff in the works.

I don't think I can announce anything yet, but big things with fun things, you know,

we we're seeing in a house with all these other filmmakers that we were

talking about Tribeca this morning.

Okay.

About how many initiatives you guys have Yeah.

And how you're making things.

You're, and how do we get our hands into some of those

buys?

Well, we don't have, you know, we're a for-profit festival, so

we use brands to get things done.

And so, you know, like at and t Untold Stories, uh, that, that is a six, seven

year we've been doing that, which is, you know, they give a million dollars

to a, to a script and they make it.

And this year take Me Home, which is here at the festival was the at t untold story.

It usually just premieres at Tribeca, but they got into Sundance so we're like, wow.

Great.

You know?

That's awesome.

We're we Berlin as well?

I couldn't, I, I haven't seen it yet.

Okay.

Maybe we cut up on that one.

Yeah, we'll cut, we'll cut this section out till June.

You got

till June?

Yeah.

No, but it's, uh, it's lovely filmmakers.

We also have things like, you know, other initiatives that Chanel

through her lens, uh, you know, for female filmmakers obviously.

But yeah, we're just trying to do, you know, use brands in a good way where,

you know, get their money and Yeah.

Help film best out.

Yeah.

That's awesome, man.

Cool.

Well, so, you know, Ben

created me to film at Tribeca.

I've had a film at Tribeca Chop Seal.

Yeah, of course.

25 years in the making.

We would love to.

My daughter's favorite film is Tower.

Is that so,

yeah.

And she's at UT now and she talks, she makes all her friends watch it.

Amazing.

That makes me so happy.

If, uh, if she ever wants to meet, uh, and have coffee in here behind the scenes, uh,

I'll, I'll let you know that.

That's a, she would love that.

Uh, that's incredible.

Um,

you could screen it for her sorority.

should.

You know, it wouldn't be the first time.

I, it would, it might be the first.

It might be shocked.

So I was shamelessly going to ask you, since you brought up, did we get

press credentials for this festival?

We did not get press for Chris.

Why not?

I don't know.

But maybe as alumni we could come Absolutely.

25th

anniversary.

Yes.

We luck and walk around and doc walk the hell out it.

Yes, we invited.

That would be

fantastic.

You're definitely invited.

And then you'll guarantee us a walk with Pop de Niro.

Absolutely.

No, sorry.

See that one in there.

I agree.

I'm doing it.

What else are you excited about for the spring journeys?

I don't know.

Hopefully we have a democracy that seems like a, like a interesting like, oh,

thoughts of, of how the world is and right now and how we're just like in this bubble

and what's happening outside this bubble.

And like all the doom scrolling I do at night and uh, you know, so I'm

trying to be, stay positive, you know, but it's like a little bit of, uh.

Just, it's just crazy and madness and,

well, where are you finding some positivity these days?

Oh, I mean, watching movies is always fun because you, you know, it's just,

there's always these groups of people who are, you know, there's, you

know, we got 14,000 films last year.

Wow.

And it's 14,000, you know, from shorts features, everything.

There's just so many amazing stories out there and people, and you hear

people fighting back and the people in Minnesota and like how they're all like,

you know, not letting this shit happen.

And so that's like, you know, the pushback and the, you know, people

just still willing to, you know, speak up and speak out and, you know, this

whole American experiment, I guess.

We'll see if it keeps going.

Yeah.

It's being tested right now.

Yeah.

You gotta take the hypothesis, you gotta apply the scientific method.

We thought we had worked that out mostly by the year 1812, but we're still in it.

You'd bring up the idea of.

Finding solace and finding positivity and watching movies.

Mm-hmm.

Do you find yourself drawn to more escapism, right, because of the, the

world, or are you able to, to kind of engage in like the stress and anxiety of,

of like kind of darker stories out there?

I mean, a little bit of both, I guess.

You know, you don't want to like be in a bubble and not see what

the world is and all these things that are happening, you know?

But it is like, yeah, it's kind of depressing when you're watching

story after story of, you know, genocide and, you know, just

death and, you know, bad shit.

So there's escapism, like plays its part to like, you know, balance it all out.

But I think watching so many movies like we do, we get to see pretty

much, you know, every story from everywhere around the world and

all things that are happening.

You kind of get a kind of a glimpse of the, you know, the world of,

well, you have such a privileged position, you see so many films.

Yeah.

That many, many of them no one will ever see.

No.

Yeah.

And that repository of like, I don't know, it seems o like

overwhelming to the nth degree.

I am so far behind in watching.

The list of movies like afis a hundred movies.

Yeah.

What do you watched 14,000 films?

I don't,

no.

watched 200.

Yeah.

Team, the team watched 14,000 films last year in preparation for the festival.

That's 14,000 sets of dreams.

Yeah.

People who want to share their work.

Right.

Uh, what is of that 14,000 that window's down to 200?

Uh, a hundred features.

A hundred shorts.

Yeah.

Okay.

And so what are you saying to the 13,800 people?

You get that

we don't get to show their film.

Yeah.

I mean, it's just like, you know, it's competitive and it's, you

know, not every film is right there.

There's a lot of different reasons.

The film doesn't make sense for a festival.

Sometimes there's, it's too similar to other films you

already have at the festival.

It's not the right fit for our festival.

You know, tone wise, not every film's gonna work at every time slot and every,

not gonna be able to fill certain houses.

And so you're programming, um, you know, for a lot of different reasons.

And you know, you have the fans, the filmmakers, the.

The press, the industry.

And so you're trying to, you know, fulfill a lot of stuff for them.

But, uh, but yeah, so it's just, you know, you just get to, you know, filmmakers

who understand that as a business.

And sometimes you're gonna make it in and sometimes you're not.

Some people, you know, they, they write back really terrible things and

get, you know, you curse at you and you never seen other film from them.

'cause this was not, you know, if making films is like something you

gotta do because that's all you can do is tell these stories and you love

it and it's not because you wanna rock a red carpet or get famous or Right.

Get rich or whatever.

Like if you're making movies, 'cause you have the story to tell.

Shit works out.

You know,

that's Jerry, we need to book you for a full out.

I know.

That was good.

Yeah.

That words of wisdom.

That was awesome.

Well, thank you so much for Super.

I excited

grabbing

stop.

He's Nancy, she's Talent.

Try back out.

So nice to meet you.

Ben Steiner.

Ben Steinman.

Nancy

Wayne, ham man.

Keith Win.

ABA Man.

Keith Bailey, Winnebago Man and, uh, tower and so many other films.

Chopping Steel.

He was at Tribeca.

Played at Tribeca Tribe.

Dear Mr. Brody,

what am I doing with this thing?

What are you doing?

You tell us

what just happened.

What, uh, what do you do at Tribeca?

Well, I'm part of the furniture.

I'm institutional.

I'm OG Tribeca.

Okay.

Yes.

OG Tribeca.

Yes.

Is that all that on your business card?

It is.

We're working on a better title.

Uh, so I oversee talent relations Celebrity, VIP events.

Oh.

But also because I have been there.

Yet, but here we are meeting.

Yeah,

that's

right.

Uh, no.

I've been there since the beginning and have gotten to be part of its

growth and expansion and so cool.

It's great.

It's fun to be here at Sundance.

Thanks for being spontaneous and jumping in with this.

Yeah,

it's like what is happening with me right now?

Why do I

have a mic and my

wait.

Who you should be really handing the microphone to is the Next Generation.

I love this dancing.

Thanks for hosting our show for us Dancing.

Look at this.

Who are you, what are you doing here at Sunday?

Um, my name is Henry Zoan and I'm just tagging along with my parents

and no, Nancy, 'cause she's the mom of one of my really good friends.

Oh, cool.

And are you a filmmaker?

She said you're the next generation.

I'm aspiring filmmaker and I try, um, really in the film theory

and starting to do my own things.

I'm a junior at the University of Vermont, so, so figure it out.

Yeah.

Um, like you said, um, there's a few different ideas I have regarding the

film industry and one of them is this website where the elevator pitch of it

is kind of a mixture of say LinkedIn and Instagram, but for film students.

And so half of it is Instagram where.

If for anybody who does production in university, there's kind of

a weird gray area where there's not really a place to post it.

They'll tell you to put it on YouTube, but if you don't have a

following, then nobody will see it.

Or they'll put it on a drive where literally nobody gets to see it.

So, right.

This would be a place where them to put their short films or their

long films, whatever it is, and share it with the, the crowd.

And then the other side is the LinkedIn side.

A place where you can say, Hey, I'm in Burlington, Vermont and looking

for an actor that anybody's available.

love it.

You heard it here.

And then cut to five years later, you're gonna be like sponsoring one of

these

houses.

That's the, that's the hope.

The name of

the, the name is realized.

And it's supposed to be a double in Chandre for real realizes and real people

seeing it and realizing your potential.

'cause that's what it's all about.

And just inspiring young people to get into the industry and do

what they love and make a change.

So anybody listening who wants to invest and

realize in

the

next year, where are they gonna find you?

Um, you follow me on Instagram, Henry under Square Z. Anything, uh,

Henry have

you bought realize.com?

I haven't yet, so please don't beat me to it.

I've been trying to, you

got about a week?

Trying to, you got about a week before

Simple.

I've been trying my best.

Don't beat me to it.

Please.

Thank you so much.

Very

much.

Just so blast.

Nice to meet you, Nancy.

To see you.

Great to see you guys.

Okay.

For sure.

Let's

do it.

That's

good.

That sounds great.

See you, Jared.

All right, let's cut.

Uh, that was Jared, nee and Nancy and that guy.

That's okay.

That guy Ben.

Cut.

I'm still here.

We're not going anywhere, folks.

Who's next?

There we go.

Alright,

we, uh, where we are walking, where are we walking up to?

Uh, the sort of iconic shot of the Sundance Film Festival,

which is the base of Main Street

if you guys live here.

We are at Sundance.

We are at the Sundance Film Festival of 2026.

Walking on a, uh, pretty brisk, uh, crisp, crisp.

Friday afternoon.

We've been, uh, walking, docking,

walking and docking.

And, and now I'm gonna swing my lens and we're gonna see what Ben's talking about.

Boom.

We're a little far away from the action for that to work.

Let's try that

again.

We're a little, yes.

Let's go closer.

Get a little closer.

We are on Main Street, but we haven't hit the main, main of

Main Street, but we're about to,

we're about to.

This is basically it.

Like we're, I think we're,

what are we doing here today, folks?

Taking a picture.

Hello?

Can I get one of both of you in it?

Would you

us to?

Would you like wait together?

Sure.

Yeah.

Alright, I'll

take it.

Okay, go ahead.

Yeah,

we're

bite.

Yes.

Oh, it's okay.

We're not gonna, we we, we won't bite.

We, we'll just do you a favor here and take a photo.

Go the other way.

So the street looks narrow.

I'm gonna take a couple.

Okay.

All right.

What do you think?

Did you get it?

I think I got it.

You two are very cute.

What are your names?

Bill.

Bill and

Robin.

Bill and Robin.

And what are Y Allall doing here at Suns?

We are enjoying you guys, the tourists.

Hey,

what are you doing?

So you live here,

huh?

We're just right behind this blue building.

Hey.

So what are your thoughts about the film festival?

Do you like it or are you ready for it to move on?

It's been a lot of fun.

Yeah.

Sad to see it go.

Okay.

But you know, it's kind of apropos and the fact that.

Uh, Sundance.

Park City's losing Sundance.

And Sundance lost Robert Redford.

Yeah, that's right.

All the same year.

Yeah.

So it's kind of meant to be, I don't know.

Yeah, it's interesting.

Yeah.

Sort of like, seems like the right time maybe in that way.

Yeah.

Well, we could've, we could've kept doing it here.

It was fun.

Yeah.

But we have so many things that go on in Park City.

Sure.

Well, it's so beautiful.

Everybody wants to be here.

How did you figure out how to live here year round?

This seems like a, you

want the long story?

No.

Short.

Okay.

Short story.

In the sixties, they started Park City West.

Okay.

My brother was a ski instructor.

We came out to visit in Easter.

My mother found two lots on Park Avenue right behind here for $3,125.

Wow.

And that's where we are.

I'm,

that's the greatest story ever told.

So, sound investment.

Do you ever catch the movies when, during the years of the festival?

I am in a movie.

Well, tell us about

it.

Well, uh, I'm walking around on the street being a part of, uh, right now, Sundance.

Yes.

You're in the movie, you're living it and now you're in our show.

Uh, well this is a little, uh, video podcast.

We're just walking around talking to filmmakers, talking to film

fans, apparently talking to people with incredible, uh, real estate

karma and it's great to meet y'all.

That's right.

Awesome.

Cool.

Alright, well y'all enjoy the rest of the festival.

Thanks.

Thanks for welcoming us.

Yes, thank you.

Thanks for coming.

You bet.

Absolutely.

Bye-bye.

That's very cute.

Oh, that was great.

All right, so we've been here.

What are you guys doing this for?

What are we doing this for?

You want to know?

Well, we're, we're out.

We're meeting the people.

You're one of those people.

Okay.

You don't wanna get in trouble.

Exactly.

All right.

We won't get in trouble.

Oh, I'm sorry.

Here you go ahead of us here we're we are in your way.

Alright, Ben.

Causing problems on the street,

park

City

as as usual as we do.

What Buzz have you heard?

Biz Buzz.

I wanna call it biz buzz.

Biz Buzz.

This is the biz.

What's the buzz?

Biz buzz with Ben Sandal?

It's a little same.

We like to call biz buzz.

Biz buzz Buckle up for biz bows.

Well, I think my tastes, uh, are dictating what I'm excited about.

I want to see, uh, John Wilson's new documentary, the History of Concrete.

Yes.

Uh, it's supposed to be very funny and, uh, unexpected and

offbeat, just like his show.

How to with John Wilson.

Sure.

And then Sam Green is a buddy and, uh, somebody whose films I just love.

He's an inspiration, really.

He's an inspiration.

He's, he's got this sort of like infectious curiosity and

like very playful approach.

And, uh, his new film is called The Oldest Person in the World.

And, uh, all reports are that the movie's great here.

We can cross.

What about you?

Well, I keep hearing how the indie spirit is back at Sundance.

And as somebody who's never had a film play here, uh, I am, I think I've

been critical at times looking at the Sundance programming, trying to figure

out is there even a spot for a guy like me in a place like this that's in

the middle of the street ever?

And so, uh, so I've been questioning kinda what the programming looks like.

One of the big stories going around, we've talked about a little bit, six

first time filmmakers, more filmmakers than usual without distribution and open

marketplace to kick off the calendar year.

Right.

What will sales look like and, and how does, like the

mergers and acquisitions and

everybody's

talking consolidation corporation.

Yeah.

We've heard that multiple times already.

M and a, the mergers and acquisitions.

I think everybody is very, uh, on edge about the idea of Netflix acquiring

Warner Brothers and what that means for distribution and financing.

But there's not a better answer.

You know, like I, the people I've talked to have felt like Netflix

is better than Paramount when it comes to like shepherding.

At least HBO is a brand.

I don't really have enough knowledge to have much of an opinion on that.

I just want HBO to be a significant buyer Yeah.

This spring, because I have some stuff I wanna show to

them and I want them to buy it.

Well, and anytime there's an acquisition, they, that usually doesn't happen.

I, I think that's the concern.

And then also with POV and PBS being hobbled,

I-T-B-S-I, uh, independent lens, POV, all kind of like,

then suddenly everybody in our documentary industry is, uh, they've just taken

out two major players and there aren't really that many major players left.

So I think everybody's rightly concerned.

But in times of, uh, strife like this, there's also lots of new, uh, people

who pop up and new opportunities.

So,

well, it's an opportunity for opportunities.

Uh, I will say people have been optimistic.

Yeah.

In general.

Yep.

Uh, this time last year we were here and LA was burning.

While we were here

and everybody was talking about how people are gonna flee LA and that,

that's gonna pack the movie business.

That didn't happen.

Maybe what we're learning is that, uh, there's always a catastrophe and

people are always scared of something.

What's the podcast called?

Doc Walks Doc.

Hi.

No.

Yeah.

Dana Riley on Dock Walks.

Oh no.

We've been waiting.

Oh no.

Oh yeah, that's right.

Oh,

yes.

You gotta hold it up.

You

gotta hold it up.

Enthusiasm that we're looking for here in our podcast.

No, it's Bashfulness.

It's certainly, it is certainly like, who am I?

Who am I?

I'll say you are, uh, independent filmmaker.

Yeah, yeah.

College.

We can all teacher sound professional.

That's right.

A woman with a feature film that just premiered last week of dancing with films.

Yes, that's right.

Close personal friend, colleague, and associate.

That's right.

The only person who I've edited a film for.

That's

true

in this century.

Um,

although heavily in, I mean, heavily involved in the

editing of all of your film.

Oh yeah, I'm involved.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But I, I take no credit away from Austin reading.

Sure.

You were heavily involved in the edit of your film that I edited.

Did Ben Sauer meet Dana Riley?

Nice to

meet you.

Hi.

Nice to meet

you too.

Yeah.

So, you know, Keith, because you guys worked together, right?

Yes.

When I was in grad school, I, I worked for Keith, uh,

oh, you went to grad school at ut?

I was at UT Austin.

Oh, me

too.

And Oh, really?

Yeah.

Was there 2004 to 2007?

I was there, uh, 2018 to 2022.

Oh, okay.

So the COVID years.

Okay.

And I was, I was there also during that period of, I mean, essentially

COVID was Yumi and like Sarah.

But you had just lost the, the whole crew and the buzz of the dear Mr. Brody.

That's right.

With our whole world.

Well, the whole world had kind of shut down.

Yeah.

And data basically was like, data was a COVID crew at the valley

flies so far away.

I know.

That we can't even remember.

Can't even remember,

knows, right?

Yeah.

Was um,

so what are you doing here at s.

I'm here for fun.

I, uh, awesome.

I'm just here for fun.

Wanted to be here for the last time that it's in Park City.

I've never, I've never been to Utah and I So this is your first

and you're like, I

I'm never coming again.

That's my first Sundance.

Well, I, you know, in some ways Boulder is more accessible.

I, I don't know anyone with property in Park City, but I do know quite a few

of my friends have moved to Boulder.

Oh.

So that, yeah,

looking forward.

So we're

crushing

with Damon and Airplanes

next year.

Yeah, please, please.

I'm looking forward to, I am looking forward to it.

But I hear, I hear there's kind of a tinge of sadness every time I talk

to a local or someone who's from

here.

Yeah.

Well actually it seems like the locals are mixed.

Kind of divided, mixed.

Some are happy, some are sad, but really more it's people who've been coming here

for a long time seem like they're bumed and this is really an end of ve era.

It seems

like the ones that

are passing of Redford and that stuff.

That's stuff.

Yeah.

The ones that are out and about, I think tend to be the more sad ones.

They're like participating and appreciating for what it is.

They're here, they're here for the, the

ones that are glad and say good ridden are probably sitting off in their,

yeah.

Snow capped ivory towers.

Waiting for the moment.

Then these like scrubs and this

is it.

Dregs.

If you may leave there the

last time, this will be converted into the Sapphire Reserve lounge.

Unless it's always like this.

I don't know.

I've never been here.

Assume that this is not normally, usually looks,

think

that's just like an abandoned train depot.

I don't know what that is.

Okay.

Data.

Are you seeing films?

I am, I'm fortunate enough to get three tickets.

I saw, whoa.

What'd you see?

I saw Hot Water Today.

Um, which was I think a debut feature film.

I was unfamiliar with the filmmaker and the ticket was gifted to me, so

I didn't know a lot going into it.

Okay.

But I had a great time.

It was a road movie celebrates the west, and the performances were amazing.

It was a mother son story and they were both very compelling.

Awesome.

Um, I thought it was really beautiful.

Um, what is the other one that I got?

Oh, I got the barber hammer.

The barber Hammer.

Oh, cool.

Awesome.

Um, Brent Silverman.

Yeah.

Very cool.

Those are good tickets.

So Dana premiered.

Yeah.

Uh, film.

Just last week, was it last week?

I made my first, yeah.

I finished my first feature and it's screened at Dances

With Film's, New York Edition.

Oh, okay.

Okay.

Last weekend.

Congratulations.

So I'm coming off the high of something I made being seen by people.

The Body Electric.

Yes.

Our Body Electric.

It was a feature film following three elite female bodybuilders and Oh wow.

The bodybuilders were in attendance with their families.

And then we all went, worked out together at Lifetime Fitness

in New York and Fifth Avenue.

And that was, it was fun.

It felt fun.

It was nice to have them there.

And also they're like content creators and it was such a different feel.

There is something more, uh, I don't know, like ent, I dunno

if that's the right word.

Seeing their themselves on a big screen.

Yeah.

Without their makeup on and without being in control of their image.

I think it actually felt more like,

more intimate than they could handle.

Yeah.

I, well, I think, I think they were really excited about it.

I think they were way more excited about it than, I dunno, than I anticipated.

I was a little nervous.

I'm always a little nervous.

Yeah.

That's

awesome.

It was great.

How did you feel about it?

You felt great.

Um, yeah, I felt really relieved that, that it, it felt more real.

Um, and it was, it was really great.

So what's next?

Like, where can people find it or where's it gonna play next?

Since this is, as you know, since this is it's premier, hopefully it'll

be screening, uh, in person for at least another six months, hopefully

a year before we put it online or find a home for it, but, okay.

Yeah.

I'm here to, I'm hopefully gonna wander into a conversation with a distributor

here who's really anxious to buy.

Um, yeah, that's definitely the dream.

Otherwise, uh, otherwise we're doing, we're doing a grassroots screening

campaign where we're gonna plan our own events around, uh, the fitness community.

'cause there's a lot of fitness events that are opening across

the United States.

Absolutely.

A lot of influencers who can help you get the word out.

Yes.

And

that's a whole new, like, pretty exciting avenue for distribution, honestly.

Yeah.

Like if you can get all their fans to watch, give you a

dollar and that sort of thing.

So yeah.

That'd be great.

Awesome.

Hi.

It's awesome.

I'm

excited.

Nice to

meet

you.

Nice to meet you.

Oh, that's awesome.

Oh my God.

Okay.

Tower is like my favorite documentary.

Like,

zoom in on this lady.

No, like

here, you wanna take this?

Wait, when did you show it to me?

Uh, with a career back in the day.

Yeah, I watched it.

I don't know where to look.

That was 10 years

ago.

10 years

ago.

This spring.

So, and now I go to UT and I'm like, tell everyone about it.

I'm like, tower, it's my favorite documentary ever.

But, and

your dad told us you just screened it at your sorority, is that

correct?

He'll, I will like, let me know and I will put an event together for you guys

because I am Tower's biggest thing.

The tower anniversary is coming up.

That's right.

Uh, this spring, uh, is, well the 60th anniversary of the shooting is August 1st.

Okay.

And so it's the 10th anniversary of the film and I'm excited to share.

Breaking news here.

Are you leaving?

Yeah.

Can I come back?

Can I Yeah.

Come back.

Come right back.

Yes.

We'll, we'll find you.

Great talk here.

Thank you.

Uh, breaking news here.

Keno Lorber is re-releasing tower to, uh, art house cinemas across the country.

That's awesome.

Um, and so have That's so cool.

We don't have dates yet.

Do you know Brandy Brady Fox.

Oh, Brandy Fox, of course.

Yes.

You know.

Hi, I'm Keith.

Nice to meet you.

Do you know Ben?

This is Ben Steiner meet you.

Hi.

Nice to meet you.

You

knows.

Hi.

Nice to meet you.

Hi Sena.

Keith.

A nice, it was great to meet you l

that so cold

knowing

that.

Yeah.

Well they were the original distributor.

We've been with them for nine years and it was time to re-up and you never know

if people want you for a second round.

Right.

That's great.

Let's switch.

Yeah,

I'm ready.

Yeah.

Alright.

was

try sorority speeding.

No, I literally, I will get like all my friends, like sorority,

not sorority, like Yeah.

I wanna show everyone tower.

What are you studying at YouTube?

Pr.

Oh, there you go.

Makes sense.

You're working with Brandon.

There you go.

She's interning

right now.

Okay.

Yeah.

All right.

How is the festival treating you?

Awesome.

It's all right.

We got him last night.

You're gonna do Charlie X fan pit

tonight?

Yeah, we're doing the fan pit tonight.

Whoa.

I don't even know what, what is a fan part?

Um,

is that a documentary thing?

It sounds like a documentary.

It sounds like a, that sounds like a public media documentary thing.

It's a lot of fans and it's handing out and, you know,

mark Experie, man, heavy

metals.

Uh,

we're like controlling the pit, so they're gonna be like, on both sides.

And we're gonna be like, merch, merch, like Charlie, Brad, like,

we're just doing all this stuff.

Lemme see.

Oh, you're, you're like a hype man.

We, Charlie XCX.

Okay.

What's the film?

What's, what's the line of the film?

It's the, the, the moment, the moments.

I saw a trailer for the other day.

It looks fantastic.

And you guys are repping that film while it's here.

Zoo.

Look,

mom, I'm documentary.

Talk about,

this is another one.

Mom.

I'm alien.

Pregnant nails too.

Woo.

Yes.

It premieres at midnight tonight.

A bunch of Kiwis made it.

Wow.

Okay.

What's it about?

They're filmmaking duo.

Their name is Thunder Lips.

Okay.

Do you call them one thunder in one lips, or are they um,

they, you can,

they're the collective thunder.

Yeah.

They go by thunder lips.

Okay.

Yeah.

All caps.

Yeah.

They must be fans of, uh, Rocky Three

Lips, possibly.

Yes.

Um, all right.

Okay, so you got two films here.

I dunno where to go with these things.

No, uh, we're gonna be in the pit with Charlie XCX.

We're gonna be, uh, impregnating Women with Aliens at midnight with Thunder Lips.

Yes.

Awesome.

Okay.

Well, thank you so much.

And that's of course amazing that you got to you.

It's amazing for me.

I don't,

I'm your

biggest fan.

I am.

I'm amazed.

I am

amazed.

Cool.

Alright.

Awesome.

All well, thank you guys meet.

Sundance is a place of magic in talking to YA mystery thanks to Kurt.

Great to meet you, Brandy.

Bye-bye.

We'll see y'all.

Nice to meet you.

Seena, nice to meet you.

Wow.

There's a lot of energy here at Sundance, but

look at you.

I don't have any super fans coming up to me.

Well, we lost Dana Riley.

Um, we

did.

And why don't we move, we keep, uh, getting stuck in this exact spot.

Yeah.

It's kind of the same people.

Oh, that's funny.

Okay, well, we're, we're gonna keep the camera rolling, but we are on the lookout.

As night is starting to fall in Park City, the temperatures are dropping.

Yes.

And as you might recall from the beginning of this episode,

we started out, Ben was cold.

How are you now?

Uh, I've got some hand warmers in my gloves.

I've got a gator on, uh, switched hats.

I'm doing better.

Okay.

I, uh, I'm not warm.

That's what you're asking.

Let's

be clear.

He is not warm.

Okay.

There.

Uh, but you know, look at this.

This is what it's all about.

We're walking under the Christmas lights.

We're surrounded by other filmmakers.

Excited to be here.

So this is great.

You're texting somebody.

I'm looking to see where the people are at,

where are the people at?

think that's cool.

Let's get this guy.

Okay.

Excuse me sir. Okay.

You have two minutes to talk to us about what's going on here.

Uh,

you look like somebody we should talk to.

Come on.

Hey, I don't know what's up.

Talk to me.

Talk.

We are here.

You talk to us.

Would you choose Man,

my hands are cold guys.

What's up?

Oh, that's true.

What's

up?

What is going on here?

Why are you here?

What are we doing here?

What's it all about?

Man?

So I'm here at Sundance just to enjoy my time.

It met a lot just to be here for this final moment.

Yeah.

As a transition to a new space.

And so I just really wanted to engage with the community one last time, man.

And I think it's just a beautiful moment for us all.

I'm proud to be here at Sundance.

That's awesome.

So you're a director?

Yes sir. I'm a director.

Yes.

Cool.

What kind of movies do you make?

Uh, so I direct narrative films.

Okay.

Um, I directed my very first feature film called Color Book.

Okay.

Which is about a single father raising his son who has Down syndrome.

Oh wow.

Okay.

And so when did you

make that?

I made that in 2024.

Okay.

Um, and now transitioning into my second feature, and I just really

wanted to see other filmmakers and Yeah.

You know, I went on the festival tour where I got show my film and received so

much love and praise, but I just want to be in a space where I can now give it.

Yeah.

Oh, where did, uh, where did Color Book Premiere and, and what was the

highlight of the festival tour for you?

So Color book did not premiere at Sundance.

It premiered at Tribeca.

Sure.

Okay.

I won the at t Untold Stories Award where they gave me a

million dollars to make the film

f We were talking about that film two hours ago with Nancy.

We sure were, and Jared from Tribeca, they were telling us about that film.

Oh really?

Yeah.

Oh man.

Yo, so we just finished up the festival tour.

Yeah.

And, um, making that film and premiering that Detroit record

was a beautiful experience.

Yeah.

Because you, all your life, you think about making a feature film

Right.

And showcasing it in front of the audience and just seeing their

responses and their engagement to it.

Yeah.

That's all you could ask as a filmmaker.

Ab.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

So then, uh, did it get distribution outside of Trevor?

So we're still waiting.

Um, okay.

You know, distribution right now in our industry is a bit of a up and down thing.

Yes it

is.

Um, but whether, you know, wherever it happens to it, it doesn't

matter because I got a chance to take this film across the world

Yeah.

And have the experience with different people Right.

And see their reactions to it.

And as a filmmaker, that's all I can ask for.

Yeah.

Well, how can people, how can people track this film and figure out if

you find the distribution that I hope you find it matters to me.

Yes.

Because it sounds like a great story.

Thank you.

And the fact that you got a million dollars to make your first film

puts you, you know, ahead and shoulders above, uh, being this guy.

Way more than we can say.

Absolutely.

So, uh, so tell us your name, the name of the film, and how people can find you.

For sure.

So my name is David Fortune.

I'm a writer director from Atlanta, Georgia.

My Instagram is by Dave Fortune and in my film called Color Book,

you could follow that on Instagram and it is Color book film.

Perfect.

All right.

All right, well, I'll let you warm your hand back up.

Thank you.

But I appreciate you stopping for us.

No, anything.

You were, you were, you were dressed perfectly.

And I was like, that's a guy who's got something to say and I ly you were right.

There we go.

Yeah,

no, I just wanna always help and serve.

I was like, sorry.

If there was hesitation, it was like, I'm cold and I'm

trying, I get back to my hotel.

But anybody that's looking to do work or create, I always wanna support.

All right.

Be back.

Thanks to meet you David.

Thank you so much there.

Pleasure so much.

Great to meet you man.

Alright.

Have a great festival.

You too.

Alright.

Nice work.

Well done.

Yeah, that was cool.

Um,

you know, I think it's a pretty safe rule of thumbs that anybody who's like dapper

dressed is gonna be a good interview.

I saw the guy,

like this gentleman right here, we were just talking about dapper.

People being good on camera,

people with Did you run, did you run out of them?

So now you got me.

Oh, perfect.

I think you are, uh, selling yourself short.

Look at this outfit here.

Yeah.

Dapper gentlemen.

What are you guys doing here?

We're just walking around talking to folks.

How about yourself?

Uh, literally just finished the meeting and walking back to my house to take

a power nap before I hopefully have a big first Friday night and Sundays.

Hey,

what was, tell us about the meeting.

How'd it go?

Uh, what I can say about the meeting, I meeting with a financier that wants me to

help him get talent for a film, and I have a film that I want get financed, so I was

like, maybe do a straight one in ones.

There

we go.

I scratch your back.

You finance my movie.

Exactly.

There's a lot of

back scratching and movie

financing going on.

That's the game.

Yeah, that's right.

What is your, what is your name and what is your project?

My name is Rob Iff.

Uh, the project I'm doing is called Jabari's People.

Okay.

Jabari, tell us about Jabari's people.

Uh, Jabari's people is going to be direct Delroy Lindos, directorial debut.

No way.

Love, love Delroy.

It's set in Jamaica and I am the producer of

it.

Very cool.

Fantastic.

How did you get, how did you connect with Delroy?

How did this project get born?

I, I don't wanna name names.

All right.

All

this is a

mock cos behind this,

but I've established myself as when, uh, people wanna film and work in Jamaica.

I'm the person they call, uh, I'm a producer.

I've done pretty much any project that you've seen out

of Jamaica in the last decade.

I was a producer.

Oh,

okay.

And, or a lawyer on it

really?

So I facilitate productions within the entire Caribbean.

Well, are

you based in Jamaica or?

I spent half the year in Jamaica and the other half between LA and, uh, London.

I made a movie years ago called Winnebago Man and, uh, the guy in

it, uh, we were trying to think of.

Who he looked like.

And Delroy Lindo was at top of the top of the list.

'cause they have a very similar demeanor.

Really?

Yes.

So that's awesome.

We'll put a side by side.

Dayton, let's put a side by side of Jack Reney and Delroy.

And we'll see.

And we'll see how we do.

Yeah.

Um, okay.

So Friday night, big night out, you're gonna go take a power nap.

Yeah.

And then

I hope to take a power nap.

Walk us, walk us through the restroom.

You might look at your phone.

Exactly.

That's what's gonna happen.

You look at your phone and then all of a sudden you're like, wait a second,

I need to

get back there.

Lemme send this text.

Lemme send that text.

Next thing you know, two hours have gone by.

Awesome.

Well great to meet you.

Act likewise.

How are you feeling about this being the last year in Park City?

I mean, I'm excited for New times, new things.

I mean, Sundance, right?

Yeah.

The energy, the ethos remains the same.

Yeah.

I mean the goal is to champion film, right.

And champion artists.

Right.

And that's not gonna change no matter where we are.

The goal is to.

Keep telling stories that move people.

love

it.

Just 'cause we changed the place doesn't change their attention.

So.

Well, I'm pulling for you and Delroy for uh oh,

thank

you.

A big premiere in Boulder in 2027 maybe.

Hey, from your mouth to God's ears.

There we go.

Hey, tell us how can people follow, uh, people follow your projects or

just follow the authentic Delroy Linda, or you can follow at Rob

Mailer on your social channels.

Awesome

all Rob.

Cool.

Great to meet you, Rob.

Thanks

a lot, man.

Thanks.

R-A-B-M-A-Y.

Excellent.

Have a good one,

right?

Okay, we're walking, we're docking.

Excuse me.

Can you guys tell us what's going on here?

It seems like there's a lot of people here all in one place and

we're trying to figure it out.

Is this Sundance Film Fest?

What?

Crazy.

Wait, what?

So are you guys filmmakers?

Is that what you're doing here?

No, we're just passing food.

He's a filmmaker.

I'm a librarian.

We're just here to.

Enjoy.

We're just

enjoying a

fast filmmaker and a librarian walk into a festival.

Yeah, it sounds like a good setup.

Yeah.

So what do you do?

I'm an editor.

Editor.

Okay, cool.

Do you have, do you have a film here?

I had a movie last night buddy with midnights.

Oh.

Oh,

awesome.

We've been hearing about that one.

It's a wild movie.

Yeah,

that's

what people

keep saying.

It kind of a midnighter.

How

did

you go?

How was the premiere?

It was great.

It was awesome.

It was sold out, great energy there.

Lots of folks.

Had a great time.

Had the whole cast, it was awesome.

Cool.

A lot of crew came out, so we're all just kicking around for a

couple days, having a good time.

Have you been at the Fest before?

Never.

I've had movies there before, but never made the trip.

Okay.

excellent.

Well, so you're coming for the last year in Park City?

Yeah.

So it doesn't seem like a coincidence.

Are you here to like experience it before it moves?

Yeah, we figured we'd just all try to come and burn the town down, you know.

Nice.

Then do the same thing in Boulder, I guess.

It'd be awesome.

Yeah.

There you go.

Very cool.

As a librarian, how do you feel the, the fact that they show

movies at the library here?

I asked, I said, I wanna know kind of what the cut is, how much

money goes back to the library.

That's my question.

It's a beautiful space for a relatively small town.

think there's some money here that they have a good deal set up to.

I think I, I sense an inside investigation here.

I think we can, we can sniff around, we're documenting filmmakers around of

a project right here.

Yeah,

yeah.

Um,

figure that out what the loop is.

Well, will you introduce yourself?

Will you tell us who you are and just a little bit more about Buddy?

Um, I'm Josh Ethier.

I'm the editor of Buddy, um, which is, uh, a movie about a, a unicorn

who runs the children's show and the children, uh, begin to become suspicious

that things are not as they seem.

I don't wanna give too much away, but it's really fun.

It's really wild.

It's from the director of too many cooks, Casper Kelly.

Oh, wow.

Oh, cool.

Okay.

Finally getting to do like a big budget feature.

Oh, amazing.

Uh, and it's a lot of fun.

Too many cooks is a lot of fun.

That's

wild,

is Adam Penney involved in your project?

No, I don't

think so.

Okay.

I think he was a producer on too many cooks.

I didn't know if he carried through

all the adult swim guys.

We had a couple of them circle in to do like graphics and sound and little stuff.

Yeah.

Cool.

Gotcha.

was a lovely man.

He brought his old family, his, his daughters had never seen any of his

work, so Buddy was their first Oh no.

Wow.

Their first movie at Midnight Madness that sunnet.

It's not a bad way to see what your dad does.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

And it sounds like they might be working through that in

group for years to come too.

No,

they seem, they seem pretty well adjusting.

What are you working on?

What are you working

on these days?

Um, I'm working on the Orphan prequel, the next one with, uh,

William Red Bell and Dark Castle.

I took the last one with them as well.

So gotta rush back and be at work on Monday.

Awesome.

Okay.

And, and where are you based?

Are you in LA or?

I'm in la yeah.

Okay.

Very cool.

Well, we wish you safe travels.

Wish you the best with Buddy.

Yeah.

And we'll have to, uh, keep our ears out for the orphan prequel.

That's right.

I, uh, I don't think I've seen the orphan.

Regular.

Original.

This is original.

This is actually the second prequel.

Oh, the second

break.

They take the idea of like a sequel and they just keep going backwards.

Okay.

Alright.

That's very cool.

They were a lot of

fun though, so, okay.

We'll check 'em out.

Well,

thanks for stopping and chatting with us.

Y'all had a

great festival.

Enjoy.

Podcast is called Dock Walks if you want to check it out.

Dog

walks.

Uh, DOC doc, like doc documentary.

Yes.

Well, like

Docs

and dogs.

That works for me.

Exactly.

If you get a

dog for

this

and geez, I've been pushing for a duck.

You'd be to get into Duck

Walks.

Duck walk is not a bad idea.

There's a guy with an owl up there.

Let's go find

him.

We're also, well actually, here's the thing's.

Definitely talk to him.

He, uh, his owl was in like 150 movies.

What?

His, his owl was in 150 movies and he, he was a professional fighter.

He fought like Larry Holmes.

He's got, you should go talk to him.

He's great.

He ran outside of the coffee place.

Java trips.

Wow.

Alright.

Okay.

Alright.

He's

got stories.

We're, we're on a mission.

That's hot, Tim.

Okay.

Wow.

So we're on the hunt for an owl.

Okay.

I wasn't expecting that.

That's the thing is you never know what to expect when you just start talking to him.

I, I approached him, man, because he had an impressive beard.

Uh, he

did have an impressive beard.

I was glad to see that he had a film in the festival, so I didn't have to

waste our time together talking about how impressed I was with his beard.

I'm glad you didn't, uh, waste our time.

We are all glad.

He's glad I didn't.

Anyway, where are we now?

We are about mid Main Street here.

Heather Courtney just texted Heather.

Where is that party?

We would love to come meet you.

Point point.

We will find out.

TBD.

Oh my goodness.

Wow.

Who are you and what are you doing?

Because that is a fantastic outfit.

Uh,

I'm, no, it was just, just your skiing.

Yeah.

And, uh, you, Eagle Camal, USA, uh, I don't know.

Having fun.

Awesome.

You having a good time?

Yeah.

How's the, how's the slow, how's the snow up there?

It's pretty, it's pretty good.

Yeah.

It's, um, I actually was volunteer for Sundance in 2019.

Okay.

And, uh, I was like telling my family, I'm like, we gotta come out here for Sundance.

Um, we couldn't get into any movies this year, unfortunately, which

sucks, but I was like, come, gotta at least come down the main street

to, you know, take it, take it in.

That's right.

Are you filming us?

Filming you?

Yeah.

That's all right.

This is, this is very meta.

Yeah.

I love it.

What are you gonna do with that?

Uh, so my, uh, my degree's actually in film and video.

Oh, cool.

Okay.

So where'd you, where, where'd you go to school?

Uh, I went to chat Texas for this technical school in Georgia.

Okay.

So I'm trying to do something of that.

All right, man.

Yeah.

Very cool.

So, uh, you're a filmmaker as well?

Yes.

Great.

All right.

So are you gonna come off the slopes and, uh, go see some movies?

I'm hoping to, if we can get into, so.

Well, if you come in hot like you just did to us all evil up.

I feel like someone's gonna make space.

I think so.

Yeah.

And, and who's your friend here?

This my friend Spencer.

Hi Spencer.

He's, uh,

my name is, I'm a freak.

His name is, I'm a freak.

I'm a freak.

Okay.

I like it.

Yeah.

What do we got here?

We got a cramps pad.

Got all sorts of

stuff.

Got the gots.

We got a fuck racism patch.

What's the chainsaw there?

What is that one?

Mistakes chainsaw.

What's that saying?

Mistakes made Daily.

Daily.

I got my tech deck on here, man.

Man, we were just talking about Fugazi last night.

Hell

yeah.

Yeah, we were.

Hell yeah.

Do you know the drummer of Fugazi?

Brendan Canty is now a documentary, uh, film director.

He makes docs.

I didn't know that.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

That's what our podcast is about.

We're documentary directors and we walk around and we

talk to other documentarians.

That's right.

Uh, and we're here covering the festival.

Alright, so what's, so we're covering

you.

You're covering us.

Yeah.

What's your favorite documentary?

Ooh.

Oh, that's tough.

Part of me wants to say March of the Penguins.

'cause that's all I can think of off the top of my head, man.

There's

nothing wrong with those penguins.

And what do you like about that one?

I watched it on repeat when I was a kid.

It just captivated me.

You know, like, yeah.

My other favorite documentary, carts of Darkness.

Carts

of Darkness.

Oh, I love Carts of Darkness.

The, the guys racing the, the shopping carts down this down the hill.

Oh yeah, that's, I know about this.

Oh, it's bonkers.

I mean, obviously Hearts of Darkness is an inspiration and tough to live up to.

'cause that documentary is, is above almost all behind

the scenes making of a movie.

Yes.

Yeah.

But Carts of Darkness tells the story of some brave individuals

who take to the streets to race shopping carts at like speed.

You wouldn't imagine.

Uh, they're death defying.

And uh, that's all I remember about it though.

Yeah.

It's like I have grown up as a skateboarder, you know?

So I saw that and I'm like, that's next level.

Nice.

I think that's pretty sick.

What are your hopes for 2026?

My hopes for 2026 is to, um, have a, have a job inside of the industry.

Being a filmmaker, it's hard, it's hard to break in.

And, um, you know, trying, trying to get into the industry and being

able to, you know, be a part of something like that would be awesome.

Alright, we're gonna get outta here.

It's great to meet you guys.

Good talking to you guys.

Take care.

Have a great time.

Enjoy Main Street.

We'll catch you next time.

Yeah, like we have on YouTube, MTY production.

One more time.

M as in Marshall, T as in tree, Y as in yard production.

MTY production's on YouTube.

All right, man.

Got

it.

y production on YouTube.

See y'all.

We are on day three of our Sundance Adventure 2026,

day three for Sundance, but episode three or four of the

Sundance Doc Walks experience,

depending on our editing prowess and turnaround time.

Yes, we

don't know for sure.

We're just as confused as you are right now, but it doesn't matter

because look, what a good time everybody's having over our shoulder.

Right behind us here,

there are people watching movies.

There are people.

Talking about the move from

Hello

Utah.

Look at that.

Hi.

Wow.

Well it is, uh, it's not any warmer today, Keith.

Well,

my heart is warmer because we just bumped into Heather, Courtney,

Heather, Courtney.

Heather warms my heart

making us warm.

That was a really fuzzy

Did you guys plan that line?

Oh yeah.

We write these down in advance.

I do on note cards.

I slide 'em across the table to Ben.

He takes out his red pen.

He practices in the mirror a lot.

It's really, it's concerning.

I just wanna point out, we are looking at the back of the Little Miss Sunshine bus.

Are those where these guys are working hard?

There's seven.

You're excuse.

Uh, they're making hot Cocos.

Oh, how nice.

They're celebrating the anniversary of Little Miss Sunshine 20 years ago.

Apparently.

I think it's Fre hot cocoa for everybody.

Do you have a hot cocoa for Heather Courtney?

Yes, this is Heather Courtney.

Hi.

Sorry Heather.

It's okay.

I I can survive without that.

No.

Coco,

I'll come back

co Coco

for you.

I'll go back and I'll wait in line like everybody else.

If we were doing an episode, like a full episode of you, the name of the episode

might be no Coco, no Coco for you.

No.

Coco

Heather.

What?

Yes.

Are you up to here at SIUs?

I actually am producing documentary by the director Christina Ibarra.

Do I have to look at the camera or can I just look straight ahead?

Okay.

And, um, anyway, so I'm here kind of to try and talk to some people about her

film, you know, to get some interest and I also, I just got a research

grant for a new doc that I'm trying to.

Embark on, I got a research grant from Chicken and Egg.

Pinky Chicken and Egg.

I chicken.

And so I um,

are you at liberty to talk about the new project or are you the, the type that

like feels like that jinxes it somehow?

Well, because I'm only in the research stage, I'd rather, I'd rather not,

she'd rather not.

Okay.

I interview's over, it's nothing.

It's nothing major.

I mean it's nothing like top secret or anything like that.

But I'm still

not gonna tell

you.

Well, I can tell you basically what it's about at this point, but I still

need to do the research is a rural gentrification in my hometown or home

region of the upper peninsula at Michigan.

Oh, okay.

'cause a lot of people think it's a climate refuge and so people who

can do so are moving there like remote tech workers and retirees.

Yeah.

So it's changing everything there anyway, but I still need to do the research.

So Heather's got a new doc.

I do the research if you haven't heard, so don't expect her.

Okay.

What else do you wanna ask me about?

Did you see any movies?

I just saw American Doctor.

It's a amazing, powerful, extremely.

Hi, I know her.

That's Michelle Satter, sorry.

Um, extremely important film about doctors who go over to

Gaza to work in the hospital.

Sarah as volunteers.

And, uh, yeah.

It's, it's, they're

American, American doctors.

Hence the title.

Yeah.

Right.

And they go to Gaza.

Mm-hmm.

They're volunteering.

How long are they there for?

Uh, weeks, maybe months at a time.

It was Jeff and Hoot.

Oh.

So we met that owl yesterday.

He was on Keith's hat.

He was on my arm.

Snuggling cheek to cheek with who?

It was

really

unexpected.

Yes.

I'm sorry I missed that.

We expected we, uh,

okay.

Anyway, everybody should see American doctor.

I really hope it can get out there quickly and in a big way, so,

awesome.

Well, we'll keep our eyes out.

Okay.

What else are you keeping your eye out for here in Park City?

Oh my god, Heather,

did you see

that many verbal, many, so many dexterity, many cliches and, um, no, I'm kidding.

Oh, I'm actually going to see a film called Seized Oh, on Monday, which is

about a small town newspaper that the

fbi I know, I know the filmmaker Sharon and I made a TV show,

a CBS show back in 2018.

The direct there.

Really?

Yeah.

Oh, and I'm from Kansas, so I know that cool town.

Oh, and she's actually based in Kansas City.

That's right.

So she has that sort of direct connection.

I met Herion to met.

Oh, that's amazing.

Yeah, yeah,

yeah.

I met her once a couple years ago right when she was embarking.

We can see if

we could do an interview with her.

You should.

We're gonna get her on dock walks one of these days.

Yeah,

you should.

You should.

And I really want to see, this will be a nice segue.

Okay.

I really want to see Sam Green's new film, the oldest person in the world,

because I've heard from so many people that it is absolutely beautiful.

It is absolutely beautiful.

Yeah.

And we are going to interview Sam Green.

Let me tell you what, this is a different episode of Doc Walks than that will be.

And if you are listening to Doc Walks and you have heard us talking about Sam Green,

you should stay tuned next week or maybe the week after, or maybe it was last week.

Yeah.

To the Sam Green interview that we have yet to do, but with Lucy soon.

David Macel.

You guys, you got, you gotta, you got,

yes.

I, David.

How how are is Sir David is

a, he's my favorite filmmaker.

Oh, he Fiona.

She makes very pop.

We love each other.

It's so cool.

Look, David, look babe.

This is cute.

David.

Nice to meet you.

Nice

to meet you.

Hi.

David is like, Hey Stein.

I know you, you I made Winnebago man back in the day.

Oh wow.

Yes,

yes.

Oh my God, man.

Yeah.

Good to see you.

That went way back.

Wow.

In a minute.

What are we filming here?

We're doing a podcast.

The, the people I make?

Yeah.

They were duck,

they were desperate for content, so they asked me to walk with

desperate for content.

It's so funny.

We've been trying to nail down Heather for about a year.

Good.

On this podcast.

And, and we are, it took us coming to Park City.

It took me coming to Park City.

What

are you doing at, at the facility?

Uh, publicists and we've got some documentary films, documentary shorts.

It's our last, it's our last dance in Park City.

Yeah.

So we had to be here, right?

Yeah, that's

right.

So I started in 2000 with the eyes of Tammy Faye.

And last year we had 2000 meters to and dream come.

Oh.

And come see me in the Good Light, which got nominated and rats.

Beautiful.

That's beautiful.

I could say

such a good movie.

So this, this festival, no matter what location it's

gonna be in, is very important.

Yeah.

Very important to filmmaking, content creation.

And I think also to just, you know, how we can change the world

through art, through cinema.

I'm publicist boy, so I have the best job 'cause I can see the films,

react to the films and then hopefully work with, you know, um, journalists

who might have the same feeling.

And that's why it's important.

I have a job I love.

I like to be part of like this, this changed the world.

We have to World's bananas, right?

Oh my God.

But that's all like coming here.

'cause then we have filmmakers who are trying to like, through art, like just

trying to educate people or just have people take a look things from a different

perspective maybe and maybe change that.

Beautiful.

Yeah.

Here,

here.

So that's why we're here and that's why we love Sundance.

Park City and is moving to Boulder.

Let's

go's Ready?

Let's go.

We ready?

Doesn't matter.

And we're gonna go with Heather Courtney.

That's right.

Hey, ex film's gonna go to Sundance.

Let's

do it.

Let's go.

She's looking for a room in a condo.

I, I'm

counting on you.

I have to run 'cause I'm done a panel for the LA Times, so.

Oh.

Heading that way.

Tell them what's up.

You do love

you.

What's the name of your pocket?

It's called Doc Walks.

Okay.

Doc Walks.

What's up?

Dags in the house.

Dag wait.

Oscar nomination.

Come see me In The Good Light by Ryan White.

Woo-hoo.

On Apple TV Plus.

All right, there you go.

If you can vote, vote for now.

Great to see you, David.

Great.

Thanks.

See you Winnebago, man.

That's right.

Way back.

Yeah.

That movie is so amazing.

Thank you.

Right.

No, it is.

And it just, well,

I mean, I, I agree.

I'm biased.

Yeah.

But it's, it was kind, I mean, definitely it was a different perspective.

Didn't see it coming right.

It wasn't,

yeah.

It was what it was, but it was entertaining, but at

the same time, educational.

Yeah.

It's all good.

Alright.

Awesome.

Good to see you guys.

Great to see.

Thank you.

I'll see you hopefully soon.

Yes,

you will.

Okay.

I've never met him before.

He's the nicest guy ever.

David Dale's the nicest guy ever.

Everybody, um,

you right Ben, he took your, he took your, your crown as nicest guy ever.

How's that?

wait, that was Ben's crown.

Well, as, as one of the nicest guys, I feel a professional, nice guy.

I think I have to, I have to be willing to share up

the hill.

Down the hill.

So, yeah, it's my segue.

I can't wait to see Sam Green's film and, um, hopefully maybe I can get a ticket.

Will you ask him if I can get a ticket to whatever the next screening is?

I will definitely not do that.

Uh, let's definitely not do that.

Right.

I know I'm chasing,

oops,

sorry.

Anyway, um, yeah, so that's really, I haven't seen anything else and I

haven't heard about anything else.

Uh,

how many years have you been coming to Sundance?

I don't come every year, but I guess

So what, what is this your fifth, sixth trip?

Do?

Do you know?

It's

probably like my fifth.

Yeah.

Okay.

Awesome.

I think the last time I was here was 2018.

And what do you So this is my second year.

'cause I always had this feeling of like, I don't want to go unless I'm invited.

I feel that way generally.

I don't want go to a party unless I'm Yeah.

I supposed to be there.

Yeah.

I feel you.

Yeah,

I feel you.

Uh, but Keith convinced me to come last year.

I don't wanna go to parties even when I'm invited,

but that is true.

Uh, and I was worried that I would feel like a gate crasher or like, you

know, at a place and I didn't at all.

And I realized that most people that we are probably surrounded by

here are kind of in the same boat.

Yeah,

exactly.

You know, and like, uh, and it took me a while to understand that and to see

that it's really about who you bump into and the connections you made.

Exactly.

And reminding people that you're here and you're the real

lessons

are the friends we made on Main Street.

It's not.

Well, that's

true.

No, it's really true though.

It's so what would you say it's about, it's like, it's about

running into David Magdalene in the middle of Main Street, like Right.

It's about, yeah, I agree.

I have, I've only been here about 36 hours and um, I have to say, I keep

running into people I know everywhere and it feels really good, you know?

And I don't know, it feels

these are like,

I feel the same way that you do.

Like, I shouldn't go anywhere unless I'm invited.

But the thing is, we are invited.

Yeah, exactly.

I mean, yeah, we are here and we're doing shit, so.

That's right.

We are here.

We're doing shit.

Let's talk about this.

Heather, can

you swear on your podcast?

Sure.

We can.

Yes.

It's

encouraged.

So Heather, you, uh, are doing shit.

The Christina Ibarra project?

Yeah.

Oh, you should talk to Andy guys.

There's Andy.

You guys should talk to Andy.

Andy, er, chief Maitland.

It's nice to see you.

This is the doc hold.

Did you lose your voice?

Trying to get you on in September and look, now you're here.

These are my, I can't hear you.

These

are my, oh no, I'm the out Oscar boys.

I lost my voice

at the Concordia

party.

That happens to me too is the worst.

Always.

That's true.

It's kind of just like a A what?

Evergreen Tweet as my, I am Keith Morgan.

Nice

to meet

you

Morgan.

Hi, I'm Ben.

Nice to meet you.

Morgan's

plus one.

Very good.

I liked it.

Say not ai.

Not ai.

Just, just so

put it as not artificial.

I wanna get a fuck guy.

Where'd you get that one from?

Your counter

close.

Oh, thank you.

Andy says, fuck ice.

Ice

Quietly.

She says it quietly, but I'll say loudly.

Fuck

ice.

Fuck ice.

Her film is amazing, by the way.

I can't wait to see it.

You know, I was in, can see it la in September and I was trying

to get, and uh, Andy booked.

We, you were out in Joshua Tree.

Which is not, where are we staying in at Waterville

house?

Burned down.

I'm sorry.

We moved to the, sorry you had to move this.

Um,

but that's where you could get jeans like this.

That's right.

Wow.

Those are fantastic.

Look at those.

Um, how can, how can I see your film?

Where is it now?

LA Times.

Just search All the walls came down.

All the walls came down on LA

Great.

It's amazing.

Excellent on's.

Amazing.

She's doing this amazing impact campaign around it and she's

fighting for her community.

We're awesome.

Thank you.

Yeah.

Great to see you.

Have a great festival.

Bye.

You.

Nice to

meet you Morgan.

Bye.

And we should get a, uh, a photo here.

Look at this.

Yeah, A photo with Heather.

This is the obligatory Oh wait, can I get a base of Main Street?

Yeah, let's, Heather can take the picture.

Really?

My fingers are for reason.

bet.

Oh, why don't you have

gloves?

Because it's hard to do gloves and do things and,

okay.

Well, should we, should we cut?

And then,

uh, Heather, any final thoughts for the people out there in the world?

Any other people?

Uh.

Call your representatives and tell call to

action.

It's always gonna end

on a call to action.

Yeah.

And they tell them to not fund ice

so that your hands aren't ice.

Icy

scrape.

Yeah.

Also, I just wanna say I'm thankful for, um, knowing these two and

also thankful that I got to make documentaries for so long.

That's how I met these guys.

So there you

go.

Well, we hope you get to continue to, and thank you for walking with us.

We're

gonna get Heather on an

actual

hour long walk.

Okay.

Before too long

here.

So.

Oh, you know what?

We should do what?

The Austin Film Society sponsored our trip and so we should give a shout out.

Film Society.

Austin, Phil.

I love

them.

Rebecca,

or,

thank you Austin.

And I love Austin.

I'm gonna move back at some point.

Yeah, well good.

You heard it here first.

Heather's gonna move back.

So call your representative.

Tell them you want Heather back in Austin

and fuck ice

and all right.

Um, alright.

It's freezing cold.

We got a, uh, Texas barbecue to get to.

We're on our way to the Texas barbecue.

And, uh, what else?

Look, all I wanna say right now, Ben, is that a pleasure to travel to this state

of Utah with you to freeze our butts off for 12 hours a day, walking the streets.

So cool.

Everybody else here is drinking and going to movies and glad

handing and making deals

and going inside warm places.

Yeah, not us.

We stand out in the cold.

We do it for you

so you don't

have to.

So you owe us is really what, what do you owe us?

You owe us a, uh, a follow on Instagram, maybe.

Ooh,

maybe a, like a comment.

Could you mention it to a friend?

Ooh.

At the very least, we hope you're somewhere warm with, uh, people

you love and enjoying this, uh, little show that we're making.

So thank you guys for listening and, uh, more soon.

To the Austin Film Society, our friends at the long time.

Thank you Dayton.

And Sally.

And Sally, our number one.

Superman.

We know you're out there Sally.

Thank you.

We wish you were here.

Thank you to the, uh, hardworking folks at Go Valley.

Thank you to our friends at the Bear.

Oh, what a nice people.

We've

got a new intern, Izzy, who just started, I haven't even met her yet.

And thank you to Izzy, who's already working hard for us and

we can't wait to see, uh, what she does and contributes to the team.

So, uh, alright, I'm freezing.

Let's cut so I can put my hands in my pockets.

The bike.

He stayed for machines.

There you go.

Went home.

We're both a little horse, little groggy, cheeky.

Okay, this is it.

Our last moments of Park City, as we make our way back to the airport.

That's true.

We're driving away from Sundance, 2026, little er, uh, a little

groggy, but I am feeling invigorated.

I feel like I'm excited to go back home, get started again, dive back into my

projects, and, um, yeah, that was like a little shot in the arm that I, I needed.

So I'm feeling good.

How are you feeling?

I'm also feeling good.

Yeah.

I, I, I love being at Film Festival.

I love the energy of people discovering something new.

And more than that, I love the community of filmmakers who, you know, we all

come from different walks of life.

We live in different cities.

We have different focuses on our projects, but when you put.

View hundred filmmakers in a small amount of space.

It's kind of the only time I'm feel like I'm surrounded by people

who kind of understand the grind.

Mm.

And uh, and I think we're all in it for the right reasons.

Most of the folks I interacted with we're in it for the right reasons.

Well, and we're an excitable bunch.

I mean, I think that's the reason.

It's one of the things that draws us to this work is like people get excited

about stories and, you know, get lit up.

And it's fun to be around a bunch of people who are kind of lit up

about movies they've just seen, or projects that they're pitching.

And that energy's really infectious.

So I agree.

I love a film festival.

Yeah.

Well you were staying at a house with some hardworking, uh, scripted producers.

Yep.

And these guys were out just booking meeting after meeting.

They were meeting with agents and financiers and actors.

Reps.

Yep.

Lots of meetings.

Yeah.

Talking to screenwriter.

They were taking in a few movies, but I feel like if they were here

to, I don't think they even saw movie.

Many of 'em,

they were here to crunch some, uh, some numbers and press the flesh.

And

there were some spreadsheets.

Yeah.

Involved for sure.

Yeah.

And it was great.

It was great to get a little, little peek into that world.

At the same time, we also spend some time with some festival

programmers, which I always love.

Get a peek at this world right here.

Look at this

peak, at these peaks.

We're get a peak at these peaks.

Look how beautiful that is.

Yeah.

You know, and Boulder I'm sure is gonna be fantastic.

It's gonna be its own thing.

Yeah.

It's

not like this

and have lots of its own natural beauty, but this is, this is special.

So thank you Park City.

We are, uh, driving away feeling very grateful.

Yeah.

As I was saying before, Ben in drives with me and is trying

to get outta this podcast.

We spent some time with festival program.

Look, one of the things I love about the festival is like we are filmmakers

and we like talking to filmmakers, but I also like talking to executives.

I like talking to programmers.

I like talking.

To people on the scripted side.

You just, you

like talking.

Well,

I think anybody who listens to our podcast knows, Keith likes the talking,

the passive aggression is high.

After three days together, my friends,

you have been together and it's four days technically.

See what I mean?

And yes, I am counting.

Yeah.

Uh,

we've been in close proximity for, uh, 96 hours going on.

So,

and as I was saying, the festival programs we are talking to, we're

having a great time kind of discovering new talent, but they're looking

forward to a year of celebration.

Right.

We're celebrating the life of Bob Redford and, and the move from

Sundance, from Park City, uh, south by Southwest, celebrating 40 years.

Wow.

This year.

That's

right.

Tribeca is celebrating 25 years.

That's

amazing.

On celebrating turning 50 and a continued opportunity to spend

time with Ben and put up with.

All that comes with that,

where you celebr

agree.

It's a lot.

I, that's a good question.

I'm sitting here wondering that very same thing.

I I don't have any, uh, big marker because I'm younger than you are.

I want that, uh, recorded,

recognized, younger, taller, good looking.

Oh, this is successful.

Your words not mine.

Uh, except for the last part.

Um, but I'm, I'm, what am I celebrating?

I, I guess I would say I'm celebrating our first year of doc walks.

We basically started the podcast at Sundance last year,

and we're back for year two.

We have been enjoying these episodes.

We love walking, talking with Rachel Morrison about her from Joy Bubbles.

We love talking with Sam Green about his new film, the oldest person in the

world, and all of the things that make Sam Green special from his live cinema

to his life in Italy, uh, to, oh, I know.

Just

so envious Living in Italy.

Good gracious.

That's right.

Julie Goldman and Chris Clements.

Uh, they are amazing, hardest working people in show business.

And we were recognized, honest.

We were recognized this podcast us by a, uh, by a filmmaker

who will be remaining honest.

'cause I don't want put that, I won't embarrass them.

We did have our first sighting and we both, uh, felt kinda like little tiny itsy

bitsy celebrities for like two seconds.

And, uh, that felt really nice.

But more than anything, she said that she really got a lot out of listening

to the, uh, advice that filmmakers give and as a working film director,

that that's what she loved about it.

So that's exactly what we're trying to do here, and that felt really

good that it's, this is all, uh,

we use for you

for something.

Well, I do this for you.

Ben has his own nefarious purposes.

He keeps his under wraps under his good guy to me here.

But, uh, it's

true,

it's, we will explore this on future episodes.

I do it for the money, clearly.

Oh,

there are.

Dozens of cents available.

We make, yeah, hundreds of dollars every, every year.

Well, we just spread it around.

If we get another year in, maybe.

We'll, we just make that true.

Uh, special thanks to our sponsors.

Special thanks to our listeners.

Special thanks to our editors and our team back on Dayton, the Go Valley team.

The Bayer team.

Izzy.

Yep.

And you guys.

Thanks a lot.

Next time on Doc Walks.

Okay.

This episode is sponsored in part by the Austin Film Society, the

40-year-old film institution, founded by Richard Linkletter.

Austin Film Society supports non-fiction filmmaking year round through its

monthly doc night series at AFS Cinema, along with its annual documentary

film Festival doc days held every May.

Learn more@austinfilm.org.

This episode is also sponsored by the longtime.

The Long Time is a one of a kind event space located in Austin, Texas.

Hosting everything from Sandlot baseball to commercial film shoots,

art exhibitions to surprise weddings.

It's the perfect home for your next creative gathering.

The long time is the home of the Texas Playboys Baseball Club, the

host of the Annual Wizard Rodeo, and available for private events year round.

Learn more@thelongtime.com.

Next time on Doc Walks, we're taking it to the hot list, the nonfiction hot list, and

letting us into the world of everything that's going on with the nonfiction

Hot List is Austin Producer and Future Marfa, Texas Theater owner Anna Rao.

Join me and Ben and Anna as we hit the trail, we walk the lake and we

learn all about what's going on with the nonfiction hot list and how you

can get involved in getting hot and on the list and all that on a dock walk.

Next time I'm Doc Walk.

Doc Walks is created, produced, and edited by my friend Ben Steinhower of the Bear.

Hello, and my friend Keith Maitland of Go Valley.

Thanks for tuning in.